Other people’s questions

Speaker 0:00 This episode is sponsored by SpotX, the leading video advertising and monetization platform shaping digital video and the future of TV globally. SpotX's best-in-class video advertising technology is helping media owners to monetize content while connecting advertisers to premium inventory.

AdExchanger 0:18 Hey, everyone. You're listening to Social Distancing with Friends, which until now has been an Ad Exchanger Talks series. But next week, on May 28th, Social Distancing will be distancing just a little more with its very own feed within the Ad Exchanger Audio Network. Be on the lookout for it, and don't forget to subscribe so we can keep the conversation going. This is Allison Schiff, one of the editors with Ad Exchanger, reporting from my kitchen table next to, if I'm being honest, last night's dinner dishes. Today, we have a special episode planned. It's not your usual fare. I have Kunal Gupta, CEO and founder of Polar with me, and we're going to have a discussion about mindfulness and mental health. May, for those who don't know, is Mental Health Month.

AdExchanger 1:04 People are afraid and they're stressed out right now. The, uh, the FUD, fear, uncertainty, and doubt, isn't just a buzzword. It's, it's a real thing. In addition to running an ad tech company, Kunal is a board member at a mental health organization in Canada, where he's from originally, and he's a mindfulness teacher. We're gonna take advantage of that fact. The second half of this podcast will be a 10-minute live meditation session led by Kunal. Kunal, welcome.

Kunal 1:30 Thank you for having me.

AdExchanger 1:31 So you're usually based in New York, but you've been in Toronto for the last few months or just since this whole situation started. Is that right?

Kunal 1:39 Yeah, I escaped back home to Canada, and very grateful and thankful to be Canadian right now.

AdExchanger 1:45 And, uh, wh- why so?

Kunal 1:50 Uh, you know, during a, during a health pandemic, uh, you wanna be somewhere with a strong healthcare system, uh, where there's a lot of space, and, uh, where people follow the rules.

AdExchanger 2:01 That would be nice, yeah. So, so tell me a little bit about when and how you first got interested in meditation. I know it's been, it's been about 10 years, I think.

Kunal 2:11 So it's been over 10 years since I've been running Polar across a variety of, um, product lines and segments of our industry. It's a business I started right out of school. And my interest in mindfulness really grew about six years ago. And I got to a point professionally and, and personally as well, I was in my late 20s, where everything that I said was important to me at that stage in life, I was there, thanks to a lot of hard work, a lot of support, and a bit of luck. And I got to this point where I realized, like, I think I've, I've made it to, in perspective of what I was looking for. But when I got there, I noticed I didn't feel any different, uh, and I expected to. Um, so it was a real turning point for me to start to look within versus to look outside, um, for answers.

Kunal 3:02 And then meditation is something I quickly picked up as I found it to be a very effective, a very efficient tool for me to understand myself and my inner world. And it's been, it's been a journey, one that continues, but it's been an illuminating journey to say the least since then.

AdExchanger 3:18 What kind of meditation do you practice?

Kunal 3:20 I've been practicing for a long time. I've done a lot of retreat. I've read a lot of books, and, uh, I've started teaching in the last probably three years now. And what I'll say now is that pretty much all meditation is, is the same. Um, especially for anybody newer to meditation, my guidance is to not get too hung up on what technique or style. Uh, really, you either meditate or you don't meditate. There's no such thing as, as good or bad. You do it or you don't do it. Very simply, you know, there's four categories that I've experienced and observed, uh, in meditation techniques. There's observation techniques, which is where mindfulness falls under, and that's observing reality, something in reality as it is right now. Could be breath, body, sound, space, et cetera.

Kunal 4:06 Uh, there's verbalization techniques. That's where chanting, transcendental, uh, mantra would come in. Um, there's visualization techniques. You could say forms of prayer fall under visualizations, um, picturing lights or gods or other symbols. And then contemplation techniques, where a specific topic is the, the focus for the mind, where you give yourself the space to go deep into it. Um, so I'd say observation techniques grounded in mindfulness are what I, I teach the most and, and recommend as they're... I love it 'cause it's, it's connecting with reality as it is in this moment.

AdExchanger 4:44 Maybe we can talk a little bit more about the, the term mindfulness, because I, I think people toss it around a lot. But what does it really mean, and, like, how does it become applicable? Like, how would, say, leader of a company apply it to, you know, his or her life and then help their employees also become, you know, more mindful, especially right now when everything, uh, everything kind of sucks?

Kunal 5:10 I, uh... It's a big, it's a big important question. So the first thing that I'd like to share is that under mindfulness techniques which fall under meditation, the, the objective is really to cultivate a skill, and it's a skill of awareness. So, like, we know how to drive a car, uh, or cook a meal or speak a language. Those are all skills that are applicable in certain domains or times of the day or the week. Awareness is a skill that cuts through it all. It's applicable in every single moment. There are many ways to cultivate the skill of awareness. I find mindfulness-based techniques very, very practical and very useful for that. So awareness is really what we're going for here, and mindfulness is really a path to get there, a vehicle to get there and learn the skill.

Kunal 5:58 And then it applies, uh, in all contexts as, you know, as the skill of awareness Strengthens, and it is like strength training for the mind, then it's like living with the lights on. Uh, and for me personally, I realized I was living with the lights off before that. So in a business context, that's bringing more awareness to how do I feel? It's awareness to, uh, what's happening with, with my team. It's bringing awareness to what's happening with, with clients. Uh, it's completely changed the way that I run the business. It's changed the way that I make decisions. It's helped us evolve our culture significantly, and one that I think is, is fairly unique and one that I'm, I'm really proud of. And I really hope, and I'm an advocate in the mental health space, that other companies start to really cultivate, uh, this quality of awareness, this quality of mindfulness within a work context.

AdExchanger 6:48 What would be an example of, of how mindfulness has helped you in a business context? Like you were, you know, describing applying it to, um, you know, to your day-to-day. What would be an example of that?

Kunal 7:02 As a CEO and entrepreneur, there's lots of opportunities for me to get frustrated, impatient and annoyed. And, uh, in those moments of realizing something is happening that's different than what I expected, like that space between reality and my idea of what reality should be, mindfulness helps me become very aware of that and really helps me understand and accept, uh, a situation, be it the way a project was completed, be it a customer situation, something with our product, with more openness and, and really acceptance. And once I can accept here's, here's the reality of the situation, then I can take the right action based on that. Whereas I think before I would struggle with accepting, um, different things that would happen in business that, uh, were different than my expectations.

AdExchanger 7:56 What would be a few practical tips for a novice like myself to achieve mindfulness? I mean, w- we're gonna be doing a little meditation session in, in a few minutes, but more like, um, in a day-to-day way. Like I'm walking down the street, what is a, something I should have on my mind? Or I'm brushing my teeth.

Kunal 8:17 Yeah. Yeah, so it's, it's bringing awareness to what's happening in this moment. Uh, there's kind of three dimensions, and we'll go through this in the meditation. There's the physical space that I'm in, so it's, it could be awareness of the light, the sounds, the temperature, the furniture, parts of the space that come into contact with my body. So if you're walking down the streets, it's the, it's the, the movement, it's the, it's the wind, it's the noises, even if you're in your own space. So that's, that's one opportunity to, to connect with reality, is looking at the space that we're in and the spaces that we're in and seeing it for what it is. Uh, the second opportunity is our body, and that's, it's always with us. There's always gonna be something up with the body, areas of comfort and discomfort.

Kunal 9:04 And we don't have to change anything. It's really an opportunity to become aware. And then the third one, which is the most subtle, uh, but also always with us, is our breath, and to become aware of the qualities of the breath. Is it deep? Is it shallow? Is it warm? Is it cool? Uh, is it, is it coming in through one nostril more than the other? None of... There's no magical or mystical quality to our space, to our body, or to our breath. Uh, they really are an object that allows us to bring some focus, some concentration. And then in terms of how to apply this, um, so we at, at Polar have really integrated this idea of like mindful moments into a lot of our internal workings. Um, so most team meetings, town halls, all start with a short meditation.

Kunal 9:53 Uh, my board meetings start with meditation. That's been happening for probably four years now. Uh, when I'm running workshops or on stage with clients, I'll always start with a mindful moment. And I've noticed the quality of all of these sessions changes because I've given people the space to, uh, they might be physically in one space, but mentally arrive as well, let go of what was, and then be fully present. So it's this idea of, of slowing down to, to speed up. Things become more focused, more clear, um, by creating some space. I can add some specific things we've done in a distributed model in lockdown-

AdExchanger 10:33 Mm-hmm

Kunal 10:33 ... building on this theme. So after a couple weeks, I realized that everybody was working like a lot more than I wanted them to, and I didn't think that was required. Um, the lack of physical separation of workspace and home space was, was not a good thing if there are no bounds and, and guidelines. So we did a couple of things. So the first thing we did was we looked at the data of how often we use Slack, how many messages are sent per day. Uh, I published that to the team, and I challenged the team to, for us to reduce our Slack usage by 50%. Most leaders you would expect when your team has moved to a distributed model, they would say like increase co- communication and collaboration. I wanted to, to decrease it by 50%.

Kunal 11:20 Uh, we decreased it by 30% within a week. Um, so it didn't take that long to cut usage on Slack. Um, the second thing we did is after Zoom fatigue kicked in for all of us, we said no meetings longer than 30 minutes, uh, as a guideline. And I think there's only one meeting in the whole company now that's a, a regular meeting that's longer than 30 minutes. Um, so that 30 minutes become the norm instead of 60 minutes, and that includes with clients as well. And the third thing we did was we said no internal meetings after 1:00 PM, and that's a big deal 'cause that really gives everybody time, including myself, to spend time with clients and equally important, to spend time on our individual tasks and work. So all of these things, I, I bring them up in the context of a mindfulness talk because they're all about mindfulness They're not us sitting and meditating together, although we do do that.

Kunal 12:14 It's really about the theme of mindfulness to bring space, to allow for focus, uh, to remove distraction. Um, so that's been some of what we've, what we've done historically and then in this time.

AdExchanger 12:27 To take it back for a sec to the, um, the sessions that you do with clients and opening board meetings, um, I know it changes the tenor of that particular interaction, but how receptive are people to, you know, meditating, say, um, you know, again? Um, or, you know, do you ever-- do you come across people who are a little bit uncomfortable when, um, you know, they, they have to close their eyes around a boardroom table because they're used to coming in and putting down their briefcase and opening up their laptop and, you know, starting a meeting har-hardcore style?

Kunal 12:58 Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. I, I mean, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't mention, we've, we've had a no, uh, a tech-free meeting policy for probably like five years. So in our, in our meetings, like no phones, no laptops unless you're presenting. So complete opposite probably of most cultures as well. So there's always been this underlying piece. To your question, I present it and I, I, I offer it w- from a place that's very authentic and very real, and I think that helps. It is, it is a big ask to sit physically in a room with s- people, with strangers, and close your eyes. There's an animal instinct around fear and trust that gets triggered, for sure. When I think of doing business with somebody, whether somebody on my team or a client or a partner, uh, trust is a key ingredient. I f- find by connecting in a way that's like authentic and accessible, it can help expedite that building of trust.

Kunal 13:51 Uh, that's not why I do it. I'd say that's like a positive side effect. Uh, I genuinely believe and I, I teach the practices because I think they're useful for all of us. They've been very useful for me. But in a business context, it does accelerate, uh, building of trust between, uh, between people.

AdExchanger 14:08 Well, who are some of the media and ad tech CEOs you've meditated with?

Kunal 14:12 Quite a few. Quite a few. I, uh, I won't, I won't name the names, but it's definitely, in terms of people in the industry, uh, across all roles and responsibilities, it's definitely in the thousands now globally.

AdExchanger 14:26 So they can have a little I've meditated with Kunal button.

Kunal 14:30 Yeah. Yeah. I've been, I've been hosting daily live meditations during lockdown. It started 10 weeks ago, and it started for my team. People were receptive and interested. I started to invite some family members and then some friends, and then now it's turned into a, a really nice community, and several of my clients come to the live meditations. Uh, something I'm, I'm glad to provide as a, as an act of service, uh, but really it's become an act of service for me in terms of connecting with people, and meditating with, with each other is a very powerful experience. It's a different quality to meditate in a group than to meditate on your own, so I, I highly, highly encourage it, whatever form that takes.

AdExchanger 15:12 Well, you, you allowed me to sit in on one and, um, one thing that I, I noticed and, uh, somebody commented at the end of the session, a 30-minute session of you just basically saying, you know, "Feel your breath and be aware of your ribs and know that your feet are on the floor," and somehow 30 minutes went by. It went by extremely quickly. Um, it was a strange sensation of time.

Kunal 15:33 Yeah. For some, you know, a 20-minute meditation will feel like two minutes, and for some it'll feel like two hours, and for others it'll feel like 20 minutes. Uh, but really, like the focus is not on time when we're in a meditation. It's on the experience. Um, it's not about thinking. It's about observing, you know, what is happening in this moment.

AdExchanger 15:51 Okay. I think it's time for us to start our guided meditation session. So, uh, Kunal, the f- the floor is yours. Do what you do.

Kunal 15:58 Great. For everybody listening, sit up, sit up tall. If you're sitting on a chair, try and sit halfway up on the chair, so about half of your weight is in your legs and the other half in your seat. Probably the biggest tip I can give around meditation posture is to avoid back support. It helps keep the spine more straight and the mind more alert. Bring your eyes to a gentle close. I'm gonna play some soft music in the background. And begin to settle into your body.

Kunal 16:34 Notice the floor under your feet.

Kunal 16:41 Notice a chair under your seat.

Kunal 16:54 Just visualize where you are, maybe the, the city or neighborhood,

Kunal 17:05 the building,

Kunal 17:09 the home,

Kunal 17:13 the floor,

Kunal 17:17 the room.

Kunal 17:25 Notice the sounds,

Kunal 17:32 the temperature,

Kunal 17:38 and the light.

Kunal 17:52 Now that you know where you are, begin to check in with your body.

Kunal 18:04 Bring your attention to your feet.

Kunal 18:10 And as you scan different parts of your body, notice any strong sensations, tingling Areas of comfort, discomfort.

Kunal 18:23 Notice your feet.

Kunal 18:27 Any sensation.

Kunal 18:30 Maybe the temperature or your toes.

Kunal 18:37 Become aware of your ankles,

Kunal 18:44 and your calves,

Kunal 18:53 your knees,

Kunal 19:00 and thighs,

Kunal 19:08 your glutes.

Kunal 19:18 Begin to work up your back. Begin with your lower back.

Kunal 19:28 Notice your spine.

Kunal 19:39 Your upper back.

Kunal 19:46 Shoulder blades.

Kunal 19:54 Your lungs.

Kunal 20:10 Your chest.

Kunal 20:20 Abdomen.

Kunal 20:29 And stomach.

Kunal 20:39 Become aware of your hands,

Kunal 20:43 including your fingertips.

Kunal 20:54 Notice your wrists.

Kunal 21:04 Your forearms.

Kunal 21:11 And elbows.

Kunal 21:17 Upper arms.

Kunal 21:26 And shoulders.

Kunal 21:37 Become aware of your neck, both the back and the front.

Kunal 21:48 Your chin and cheeks.

Kunal 21:56 Your jaw and teeth.

Kunal 22:06 Eyes.

Kunal 22:11 Ears.

Kunal 22:18 Forehead.

Kunal 22:25 And the top of your head.

Kunal 22:42 Take a moment now to become aware of your entire body from the top of your head to the tips of your toes.

Kunal 23:16 Gently bring your attention now to your breath.

Kunal 23:26 If helpful, you can pick a part of the body where you can visibly feel the sensations of breathing.

Kunal 23:37 Maybe your nostrils, your throat, chest, or stomach.

Kunal 23:59 And your sole responsibility right now is to quietly observe each inhale and each exhale

Kunal 24:16 as if you're not gonna let a single one escape your attention.

Kunal 25:03 If your mind begins to wander, know that's completely natural and expected. You can gently bring your attention back to your breath.

Kunal 26:26 Begin to connect back to your breath.

Kunal 26:41 Begin to connect back to your body.

Kunal 26:50 Notice the weight in your legs,

Kunal 26:56 in your arms,

Kunal 27:01 torso,

Kunal 27:04 and head.

Kunal 27:16 And begin to visualize where you are. Notice the floor.

Kunal 27:23 Notice your chair.

Kunal 27:32 And take a moment to

Kunal 27:36 quietly reflect on anything that may have changed over practice today, in this 10-minute period. Has anything changed in your physical state,

Kunal 27:52 your mental state,

Kunal 27:56 or your emotional state?

Kunal 28:20 Take a deep inhale

Kunal 28:24 and a slow exhale.

Kunal 28:29 Bring some gentle movement to your fingers and toes as you slowly open your eyes and come back to your space.

Kunal 28:48 Thank you for sharing practice with me today.

Kunal 28:53 Meditation is something that you can start with two minutes a day. That's a nice way to get started. What we did today was about 10 minutes. Thank you, Allison, for giving me the opportunity to share practice and my passion for these topics.

Speaker 29:13 Thank you for helping me forget about my deadlines for 10 minutes.

Speaker 29:20 This episode is sponsored by SpotX, the leading video advertising and monetization platform shaping digital video and the future of TV globally. SpotX's best-in-class video advertising technology is helping media owners to monetize content while connecting advertisers to premium inventory.