Other people’s questions

Sergey Sander 0:01 We are in the heart of Lisbon, the capital of Portugal. Meet Kunal Gupta, an entrepreneur, investor, AI enthusiast, and author of the book, How to Live.

Kunal 0:12 I came here spontaneously. I was living in Canada. I'm originally born, raised, educated in Canada, and decided it was time for a change, and booked a flight, came here. I didn't know a single person. That was two years ago, and now I'm well settled.

Sergey Sander 0:27 Kunal moved to Portugal and is living in the center of Lisbon in a new apartment block in the trendy area of Principe Real. I went to his home to find out why he moved from Canada to Lisbon, how life in Southern Europe differs from North America, whether it's worth investing in real estate in Portugal, how to run a global company while living in Lisbon, and what is his advice to readers in the coming book, How to Live.

Kunal 0:55 How to Live is my first book. I'm working on my second one right now. It will be live on Amazon, e-book, audiobook, and paperback, and then my website is howto.live. In it is a chapter called How to Move to Portugal. I'd say three things that I would, I would advise. The, the first is really to emotionally commit, to say, like, "I'm not just coming here physically, but I'm coming here with my mind and my heart." I've met literally hundreds of, of foreigners living in Portugal, and I could see a clear difference between those that are, that are here emotionally and those that are just here physically, but emotionally still distracted, I would say, you know, with life back home. So the real opportunity is to, to see it as a blank slate, as a, a chance to make new friends and a chance to, to, to be who we're meant to be. And I've seen myself getting interested in hobbies, getting interested in different activities, showing up in a different way than I, I, I did back home.

Kunal 1:45 And the second is to say yes. Now, there's so many opportunities to explore new cultures, you know, new tastes, new people, and just saying yes to opportunities. I'd lived in New York for 10 years. I'd become like a no person. Anything that'd come up, I'd say, "No, no, no, no, no." And here I say, "Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes." And that's been a lot more generative in life. And the third, specific to, to, to real estate, you know, my journey was I came here spontaneously. I was in an Airbnb for three, four days at a time and exploring different neighborhoods. And then I started to do Airbnbs for one or two weeks at a time to get a bit more settled. And then I found a, a short-term rental, a medium-term rental that was furnished, you know, hassle-free. It was probably more expensive than it was worth, but I, I appreciated the convenience. And then while I was in the furnished rental, I started to look for my, my home, and that's where I found this.

Kunal 2:33 I own this apartment, and it's my home, and I absolutely love it.

Sergey Sander 2:37 Did you buy it on plans, or it was already finished when you arrived?

Kunal 2:40 This is a new construction. Uh, I bought it from the original investor who bought it four years ago, and I bought it actually right before the building was opened.

Sergey Sander 2:48 So your strategy is to come first, to rent it, emotionally be engaged in life here, and then to look for investments.

Kunal 2:57 Yeah. Start, you know, crawl, walk, run. So, you know, quick short-term rentals, and then a more medium-term rental, and then find, find the home. I think that's the best way because, uh, I got to understand different neighborhoods and then make the right choices based on that.

Sergey Sander 3:13 What are your favorite locations and neighborhoods in, um, in Lisbon and also around?

Kunal 3:19 I'm currently single. I don't have kids, so being in the city, it's helpful. It's easier to meet people. It's easier to get around. I can walk a lot of places. So I live in Principe Real, so it's right in the heart of the city. Next door is Estrela and, and Lapa and Santos. So these are all areas that I find myself in a lot, and a lot of my friends, they live in these ar- areas as well. I do go to Cascais often. That's where most of the real estate I own is based, and it's a 20-minute drive. And I go to the beach there. I go, you know, for business reasons. I'm there a few times a week. And having a car, actually, that's a big advice I'd have, is have a car. Uh, that really gives me movement and mobility, and I can get anywhere pretty quickly.

Sergey Sander 3:58 You need a car living here in, in Lisbon?

Kunal 4:01 In the city center, you don't need a car, but I advise you to have a car.

Sergey Sander 4:05 Big one or small one?

Kunal 4:06 Small one. My car is a, it's not a big car, but it has lots of scratches and dents on it because I'm not used to the European, um, you know, streets and the alleyways.

Sergey Sander 4:17 Electric car?

Kunal 4:18 I bought my car two years ago. But if I were to buy a car now or my next car, it will be electric for sure.

Sergey Sander 4:24 I asked Kunal if he would let me see the apartment. I loved the spacious, light, airy living room with floor-to-ceiling sliding windows and stunning panoramic views of Lisbon and the River Tejo.

Sergey Sander 4:40 If you like my videos and want to support me, please like the video, leave a comment, and subscribe to my YouTube channel. The living room has an open plan, modern, and fully equipped kitchen.

Sergey Sander 4:55 The apartment features three bedrooms with en-suite bathrooms, plus an extra guest toilet. Each bedroom has access to a terrace or a balcony with panoramic city views.

Sergey Sander 5:10 If you need help finding an apartment in Lisbon, feel free to message me on WhatsApp or Telegram. All my contacts are below.

Sergey Sander 5:19 We continued our conversation on the main terrace, and I asked Kunal how much it costs to have a view like this.

Kunal 5:26 This is a priceless view. I actually walked into this apartment, and within five minutes I was like, "Yep, I could see myself living here." So I didn't even actually go in the bedrooms. I just stood behind the kitchen counter, looked at the view, and I thought, "Okay, I'm gonna live here."

Sergey Sander 5:39 So what is the average price per square meter in this area at the moment?

Kunal 5:43 In Principe Real, you have two, two segments. So one is older, uh, buildings, which I would say is about 6,000 per square meter, and then the other would be modern. Um, so newly renovated or new construction, closer to 10,000. Something like this is, is, is, is different, but there's not a lot of product like this on the market, or there's actually no product like this on the market.

Sergey Sander 6:02 And how easy it is to find an apartment to rent in this area?

Kunal 6:06 The rental market in, in Principe Real and surrounding neighborhoods is crazy hot. Uh, there's a lot of people coming to Lisbon, and couples, single people, even if they have a young kid, they wanna live in this, in this neighborhood. There's a lot of demand. So it is, it is challenging to find something that's high quality and at a good price.

Sergey Sander 6:25 How comfortable is to live in Portugal comparing to Canada and US, especially big cities?

Kunal 6:33 Living in Southern Europe is different. It's different than North America and what I was used to. I think it's much better. My parents have come to visit often, my sisters come to visit often with their family, and all of my North American visitors also agree that it is better. It's a quality of life focus, um, in, in Southern Europe, versus in, in North America where the... it's very competitive. Everything is a hustle, everything is a race. To just buy groceries, to get to work, to, you know, get tickets to a movie, everything is competitive. Here, things are different. The priorities are our lifestyle. And, uh, ultimately, that's, that's why we're here on, on hotel Earth, is to, is to live and to live well, and I think I've found that here in Europe.

Sergey Sander 7:18 How to find the best place to live in Portugal if you compare Lisbon, Algarve, Porto?

Kunal 7:24 If you're new to Portugal, 100% come to Lisbon. I, uh, when I first got here, I did go around the country a little bit and I realized what was more important for me in my first stages was to build community, to make connections, and to make friends. So, uh, everybody moving to Portugal moves to Lisbon first. That's where you're gonna connect with foreigners, uh, at whatever stage of life that you're, you're in. I think over time I've seen people, after spending a year or so in Lisbon, they might move outside of Lisbon. But at that point, they're settled, they're comfortable, they understand how to live in Portugal. But definitely Lisbon is the place to move to when you're first new to the country.

Sergey Sander 8:01 For whom Portugal is not a good fit?

Kunal 8:03 Depending on the stage of life you're at and what your priorities are. If you're trying to prioritize quality of, of life, Portugal is great, and there's other great places too in, in Southern Europe. If you're trying to make the most amount of money, if you're trying to climb the corporate ladder, if you're trying to, you know, scale your, your, your business and be super aggressive, there's probably other places that you'll move to if career and profession, uh, and financial, uh, earnings are the focus. It's a question of do you live to work or do you work to live?

Sergey Sander 8:35 If not Portugal, what other countries, jurisdictions are offering great quality of life and great opportunities for business investments?

Kunal 8:44 Over the summer, I, I went on a Southern European tour. I went to Spain four times, I went to Italy, I went to France, I went to Monaco, I went to Greece, and different parts of Portugal. So literally, like, every week I was somewhere different in Southern Europe, and I absolutely loved it from a quality of life standpoint. Every place in Southern Europe has its own charm, um, and its own challenges as well. I don't think it makes sense from an investment standpoint to spread yourself thin across these different places. Despite them all being part of the EU, um, they all operate slightly differently, and there is a learning curve in terms of building the right relationships, the right tax structures, the right, you know, teams. I'd pick a jurisdiction and, and focus on it. That's what I've done. I've focused on, on Portugal, and I've treated the rest of the surrounding places as a place for tourism and lifestyle.

Sergey Sander 9:32 Finally, we discussed the real estate investments in Portugal, the yields, and Kunal's ongoing projects and opportunities in AI.

Kunal 9:41 I've been actively investing in property in Portugal. I come from a real estate family. And I, I do see it as a good investment from a long-term basis. There's a lot of development happening in Portugal, both in terms of the economy, this transition from manufacturing and industrial-based to knowledge-based, and that creates, uh, a lot of jobs, a lot of good-paying jobs. So you're seeing a lot of people move to Portugal. People are moving here primarily to live, and I think people are gonna start to move here as a place to work, and that's gonna create obviously a demand for real estate, but then also other investment opportunities when it comes to knowledge-based industries.

Sergey Sander 10:16 What kind of projects inspires you now? What are you investing in? What are you developing?

Kunal 10:22 I'm excited to continue to invest in real estate. Uh, I've been in- focused on the luxury segment, 'cause it's a segment that I understand and I have access to the clients and I have empathy for. I've been looking at co-living as a, as a concept. And I think the socioeconomic wave that we're going through over the next couple of decades means a lot of people between, say, the ages of 25 and 35 who might be single, um, may not be able to afford or may not even want to be living on their own far away from the city, and would choose a co-living concept, you know, closer to city center, a sense of community. So I'm exploring that, um, as a new, um, real estate strategy. And then I think Portugal is a, it's a beautiful place. It's one of the longest coastlines in, in Europe. Uh, a lot of the development has been concentrated on the big cities, Lisbon, Porto, Algarve region, so I'm also looking at investment opportunities outside of the core cities.

Kunal 11:17 Center of Lisbon is, is a core asset similar to any other major cities. So you're looking at about 4% unlevered yield, like any other core market. If you look outside of Lisbon in the surrounding areas, then the yields start to get higher, to 7, 8%. You do have some location risk in that sense. And then a market like Cascais, which is a suburb of Lisbon, um, it's by the ocean, kind of on a corner. So there's, you've got water on two sides. There's not more of Cascais being built. So because of that, yields are probably around the same 4% mark.

Sergey Sander 11:49 AI projects. What projects you are investing in and what projects you are developing?

Kunal 11:54 I have a tech background. I've been building tech companies for 20 years now in Canada, the US, and around the world. Over the last year, I've started to invest in building an AI company here in Portugal. Uh, it's called Pivot. It's a global business, but headquartered here. And we're doing three things. Um, we're building our own businesses. I've hired 40 people in the last 100 days here in Lisbon, and we're incubating and creating our own companies. We're launching, uh, an investment fund to invest in other people's AI companies, uh, in Portugal and Europe and around the world. And then third is we're building community. Um, we last night had a big event with 200 people, and we've been bringing a lot of people together on the topic of AI. It's a very exciting time to be in AI. A lot of what's going to happen we don't know, and that's the best time to be part of something, where we don't know. 'Cause we get to imagine, we get to create, and we get to build.

Sergey Sander 12:41 Is it possible living in Portugal to run a global business?

Kunal 12:45 It is absolutely possible to run a global business while living in Portugal. Uh, I have a, a, a tech company that's headquartered, that started in Canada. I was CEO for 15 years. I chair the board, and the business is, is, is global. I'm starting the next company called Pivot from Portugal, but it is a global business. I think that it probably has more to do with the, the last couple of years and how we've transitioned to this work from home model. People are comfortable doing transactions and big deals, uh, over Zoom calls and Google Meet calls and Team calls. They don't always have to be in person. We have access to talent kind of all over the world, and that's the special thing about Portugal in this moment is people from all over the world are moving to Portugal. Very talented, very smart people. So of my team here, 50% of the team are, are Portuguese, 50% are expats, and it's created this unique culture.

Sergey Sander 13:37 If you have any questions left about living and moving in Portugal, please write in the comments. And if you want me to help you to move to Lisbon, feel free to message me on WhatsApp or Telegram. All my contacts are below. And like this video, subscribe to my YouTube channel so you won't miss anything exciting in the future. That's it for today, and I look forward to welcoming you in Portugal.